NATO’s dialogues: America’s (next) threat to go

<p>President Donald Trump has long threatened to pull America out of the alliance. We examine why the Iran war has made this time look significantly <a href="https://www.economist.com/europe/2026/04/05/european-allies-are-losing-hope-of-keeping-america-in-nato?utm_campaign=a.io&amp;utm_medium=audio.podcast.np&amp;utm_source=theintelligence&amp;utm_content=discovery.content.anonymous.tr_shownotes_na-na_article&amp;utm_term=sa.listeners" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">more serious</a>. Westerners are fleeing their countries in <a href="https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2026/03/22/westerners-are-fleeing-their-countries-in-record-numbers?utm_campaign=a.io&amp;utm_medium=audio.podcast.np&amp;utm_source=theintelligence&amp;utm_content=discovery.content.anonymous.tr_shownotes_na-na_article&amp;utm_term=sa.listeners" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">record numbers</a>—with economic consequences for their origins and destinations. And our series profiling the countries contesting the World Cup starts with Spain.&nbsp;&nbsp;</p><br /><p>Guests and host:</p><ul><li>Anton La Guardia, diplomatic editor</li><li>Callum Williams, senior economics writer</li><li>Jon Fasman, senior culture correspondent</li><li>Rosie Blau, co-host of “The Intelligence”</li><li>Jason Palmer, co-host of “The Intelligence”</li></ul><p><br /></p><p>Topics covered:&nbsp;</p><ul><li>NATO, war in Iran, Donald Trump, Mark Rutte</li><li>expats, emigration, economics</li><li>World Cup, Spain</li></ul><p><br /></p><p><em>Get a world of insights by </em><a href="https://subscribenow.economist.com/podcasts-plus" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>subscribing to Economist Podcasts+</em></a><em>. For more information about how to access Economist Podcasts+, please visit our </em><a href="https://myaccount.economist.com/s/article/What-is-Economist-Podcasts" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>FAQs page</em></a><em> or watch </em><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gczo71bg1uY" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank"><em>our video</em></a><em> explaining how to link your account.</em></p><hr /><p style="color: grey; font-size: 0.75em;"> Hosted on Acast. See <a href="https://acast.com/privacy" rel="noopener noreferrer" style="color: grey;" target="_blank">acast.com/privacy</a> for more information.</p>