Ben Shapiro on the Most Dangerous Force in America

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Conservative commentator Ben Shapiro sees the civilizational battle of the modern era as one between the builders and the destroyers—or as he writes it in his new book, between the “lions” and the “scavengers.”

When I sat down with Ben this week, he explained the way he sees this dynamic play out in American society—across both political parties—as “scavengers,” who feed on grievance, identity politics, and moral relativism, cut down the progress of “lions,” who choose responsibility, courage, and a commitment to truth, even when it’s unpopular.

Over the past two years, Ben has seen the scavengers ascendant, as America and Europe have exploded in violent protest against their own institutions, blaming their ills on the free markets and constitutional republicanism, or on the “military-industrial complex” and “global Jewry.”

I spoke with Ben about the way out of the darkness—which he thinks can best be found in religious values: family obligation and procreation, moral order, and meaning beyond the self.

Our conversation ranged across birth rates, wokeness, and the Donald Trump presidency, with moments of both agreement and debate. I came away with a clearer understanding of his worldview—one that frames the future of Western civilization as a high-stakes struggle, more fraught than ever.